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Our Second Chat: February 14, 2002 
Andrew Shroyer>>Hello
all you chatters out there! Les Canterbury>>Hello
Kelly Janousek>>kj:
I am the only one from long beach today...Eileen has to do reference
Andrew Shroyer>>Is someone planning a weeding project--or just thinking about the needs? we've done a periodicals weeding project here at LA... Kelly Janousek>>LB
just finished a large reference weed and has a ongoing full collection
weeding Jennifer Laherty>>Hayward
is weeding the entire book collection and has weeded (several times,
lately) the ref. collection Kelly Janousek>>for
the reference weeding we developed principles of what should be
appropriate to keep in reference, has anyone else developed in writing
a weeding plan? Diana Wu>>SJSU
in undergoing a massive weeding and inventory project in preparation
the move to the new Joint Library. Andrew Shroyer>>I
think the most sensitive "how to" questions involve the awareness/input
of instructional faculty. what do you think? Jennifer Laherty>>At
Hayward, we're basically weeding the book collection according to
what currently supports the curriculum - that's about all the plan
we really have. Instructor>>CSULA
also is in the process of weeding 16mm films -- we developed criteria
and are giving our faculty a chance to review the list of films
we want to "de-select" Jennifer Laherty>>As
to "how to involve the faculty," it's different for each dept. relationship,
but I've had tremendous involvement with nursing and biology. Andrew Shroyer>>We
had a set of guidelines we followed for periodicals--basically we
were looking for short runs, older, unindexed--or in esoteric subjects
for us... Instructor>>I'd
like to know what most of you are interested in hearing about at
the CARL pre-conference on weeding -- sounds like developing criteria/guidelines
is a big issue? Diana Wu>>re
couple guidelines been developed according to the Academic Senate
policy. Kelly Janousek>>does
anyone else go as far as the Academic Senate on their campus? Jennifer Laherty>>Hayward has not gone to the A. Senate Les Canterbury>>developing
guidelines - yes. Also, some info. on nuts-and-bolts processing.
We've run into bottlenecks once items are identified for weeding.
Instructor>>Can
you give an example of a bottleneck? Diana Wu>>SJSU
has the endorsement from the University Library Board, which is
a policy body of AS. Any major changes or modification will go the
AS for discussion. Les Canterbury>>yes
- not enough staff time to process weeded items - a backlog - with
a catalog record saying "in process" instead of removal from the
catalog Andrew Shroyer>>Diana--
Did your Senate have a pre-existing set of parameters re the library
collection? Or did you seek input specifically on what could/couldn't
be weeded? Diana Wu>>It is spelled out in the AS library policy for weeding/ periodical review of the collection. Kelly Janousek>>our processing problems were not just leaving the collection but relocating and not having shelving room. Andrew Shroyer>>We suppressed records for titles withdrawn so that they couldn't be viewed by the public (while processing the volumes) Instructor>>Are
the weeding policies of your libraries a part of an overall collection
development policy? Kelly Janousek>>yes
Diana Wu>>It
is served as the general guidelines. Leslie Swigart>>Any
wrangles about differing needs of different disciplines, eg. business
*real* current vs. history or literature 'old ain't necessarily
not needed'? Andrew Shroyer>>We
had multiple reviews by librarians before releasing a pored-over
list for review by instructional faculty--and had very few reversals
by the latter... Kelly Janousek>>i feel some of our policies are "space" driven by the size of our facility Instructor>>I'm
curious about another question -- do individual departments (committees,
task forces, etc.) handle various "parts" of the collections --
Reference weeding is handled by reference staff, for example? Instructor>>Or are weeding projects generally a "library-wide" process? Jennifer Laherty>>Hayward's
is library wide. Kelly Janousek>>our
projects have been based on who collects in the area, must also
weed in the area Leslie Swigart>>What do you all do with w/d materials that excess duplicates are in good condition but just dups? Throw out? Ask other libraries if they'd like it/them? Andrew Shroyer>>Kelly, we followed the same rule. Selectors are also de-selectors in same subjects... Cynthia Bruns>>We generally prefer that Reference be weeded by librarians who work Reference, though sometimes that is not possible. Diana Wu>>Ou AS library policy resides at http://www.sjsu.edu/senate/f98-5.htm Leslie Swigart>>Kelly's right: If it's "your" area you do it ALL: stack materials, ref materials, media, periodicals . . . Jennifer Laherty>>I probably misunderstood, at Hayward, the selector that selects also deselects... Kelly Janousek>>I find this process may confuse some other librarians who use particular titles and one day find them gone Andrew Shroyer>>Leslie: we offered our withdrawn vols to a OP/backfiles vendor, before actually discarding. Served us well in the sense that we could report to campus that we were donating elsewhere rather than *really* throwing away... Kelly Janousek>>andrew is this staff intensive? Leslie Swigart>>Andrew: Are the w/d volumes just periodicals? Or other books/materials? Instructor>>When we're ready to get rid of our de-selected 16mm films -- I'll be putting out a call to other CA libraries to see if anyone wants them -- we'll try to find a good home for them, not just dump em... Andrew Shroyer>>Kelly--that's why *awareness* (with multiple opportunities to object to individual titles going away) is important Michelle Blackman>>Our Reference "Chair" puts a cart of books being considered for withdrawal from the Reference Collection out for each librarian to give input as to whether to move to stacks or keep or withdraw--it gives others a chance to state their opinion Diana Wu>>I believe they need to be offered to other CSU community before anyone else since they are state property. They were purchased with state fund. Instructor>>That's a good idea -- at my previous job at George Mason in VA, we did a similar thing -- every time we had a reference staff meeting, we'd just go through the weeding cart together, discuss, and make a final call... Andrew Shroyer>>Kelly, Lesley: our recent experience is just with a per. deselect--and some ref. items--no monographs. The end-processing was somewhat staff intensive--but once the records were suppressed, we took our time finishing up, rather than try to find more staff... Kelly Janousek>>our problem is still space we are de-selecting approx. 10,000 volumes per month Instructor>>DW -- I agree -- I just don't know if anyone in the CSU still uses 16mm films! :-) Leslie Swigart>>Some of my decent duplicate but 'excess-to-current-needs' items (English, Comp Lit, Classics, Film/TV) I'd LOVE to offer to other CSUs, like Channel Islands or Monterey Bay, but have been told "don't go there!" by admin. Instructor>>KJ -- why such a large volume of weeding? Kelly Janousek>>reduction in library space by the campus.... Diana Wu>>At SJSU, selectors make the final decision if items will be transferred to stacks or discard. Cynthia Bruns>>10,000 volumes per month! What a job. How much organization has that required? Leslie Swigart>>LOTS!!! Instructor>>That brings up an interesting point -- we're rather fortunate at CSULA to have a lot of space still open -- are most of your libraries getting filled to the brim? How much pressure is this putting on the demand to weed? Kelly Janousek>>as Leslie said it is a top priority here we are at the brim! Cynthia Bruns>>Fullerton with the new building still has some room so we are not under a great deal of pressure at this time. Andrew Shroyer>>Kelly: how long has the 10K /mo. pace been at hand? Kelly Janousek>>Andrew about 18 months Instructor>>Do you feel you're having to weed things simply based on space -- not other factors? Kelly Janousek>>I don't know how Leslie S. feels but I think sometimes I am deselecting things I normally would not really let go... Instructor>>And there is no sign of library space expansion in the near future? Leslie Swigart>>And with periodicals there is the problem of not having $$$ for MForm replacement of desired titles, and wondering if this title or that will be added to JStor or other e-archive but not wanting to "give up" a backfile in disciplines where backfiles are important. Kelly Janousek>>We did have other factors...we do have guidelines....runs of non-circulating titles to consider... Leslie Swigart>>Expansion! HA! HA! HA! Diana Wu>>Depends on the need. SJSU in evaluating the international business since this major will be added to the curr. Michelle Blackman>>When we got a great block grant to buy new titles (remember the good old days?) our big weeding effort was to clear out books with older publication dates--unless "classics" so we had a "Need One? Weed one" campaign that scheduled faculty members to come in and deselect directly from the tightly crowded shelves. We rotated through the departments and had faculty members working with their "liaison" librarian. Instructor>>Now there's an idea -- let the faculty do the weeding! Andrew Shroyer>>Are teaching faculty sometimes facile in their approach to judging proposed withdraws? I've heard stories at libraries of faculty saying a title "sounds too important" not to keep... Diana Wu>>Some departments will work collaboratively with liaison librarians, some delegate the decision to librarians. Leslie Swigart>>Riiiiiggggghhhhtt! I'll weed this other guys area but don't you touch mine! Cynthia Bruns>>Did the faculty make logical deselction decisions? Kelly Janousek>>I look at what faculty want to donate to the library and think "ask them to weed" ha Michelle Blackman>>We relied on the expertise of the faculty to catch the "classic" authors/titles that a librarian might not appreciate. Kelly Janousek>>Michelle how do you do this? Andrew Shroyer>>But they write those off their taxes, Kelly... Instructor>>Do you think generally the physical condition of the collections is such that it's not a big factor in what should be weeded -- and if condition of materials is bad, would/should they get replaced with new editions? Leslie Swigart>>Yeah! Do you all get the 'sweepings out' of retiring faculty's offices? Instructor>>I hope that most of the "sweepings" end up in the library book sale... Kelly Janousek>>We have in place in our collection development area shelves to review of damaged materials for replacement--different process Michelle Blackman>>That was several years ago--faculty in "my" areas would check through shelves of items I'd selected as potential withdrawals and "flag" any they thought should be kept in the collection. Leslie Swigart>>Books sale? You get to have book sales? I could only hope.
Instructor>>Our "Friends of the Library" group does a sale once a year...but I think that applies mostly to gift donations that are not accepted -- not weeded materials -- am I right, Andrew? Kelly Janousek>>Leslie be nice we do "sell" our books....just to a paper recycling place. Andrew Shroyer>>Leslie, yes--many of our wonderful boxes of gifts go right into the gook sale... Michelle Blackman>>Withdrawn books go on a "25-cent" table in our lobby. We sometimes put out donated items that are not accepted into our collection, too. Cynthia Bruns>>It is often hard to find much of value in donated books, though there are exceptions (few) Kelly Janousek>>basic question: how much of your collection development "time" do you use for de-selection? Andrew Shroyer>>Has anyone had the experience of faculty proving to present serious obstacles to getting very much weeding done? Or have they just insisted on "the odd" reversal here & there? Instructor>>Time? You have Time for collection development -- ain't you lucky! :-) Kelly Janousek>>Here I think I am do 50% collection purchasing and 50% collection de-selecting Leslie Swigart>>I review stuff for our recreational reading collections (SF & F, mystery & detective) and would love to put the excess copies out for 25 or 50 cents/per. Andrew Shroyer>>The book sale notion is a good safety valve to avoid crowding shelves with dreck... Instructor>>But seriously, I've only been here at CSULA a little over a year, and we haven't devoted all that much time to weeding -- but then as I mentioned space is not a pressure point yet... Les Canterbury>>How about campus politics? Do you hear howls of protest about pulling books off the shelves? Andrew Shroyer>>Realistically, weeding is back burner unless there's a compelling need, like a space crunch--I think... Michelle Blackman>>Weeding tends to go in "waves" when the shelves are too crowded to add new titles. Kelly Janousek>>We have been caught before...and man can they howl. Instructor>>I also do get the sense that our faculty are very touchy about weeding -- the UL doesn't even like us to use the "W" word....and they just approved (this year) the removal of the card catalog! Leslie Swigart>>Sometimes, even when you have mfilm of periodicals . . . Cynthia Bruns>>I have had faculty come and talk to me, worried that we are tossing valuable items. This was based on worry only. Kelly Janousek>>I have found that weeding helps me with inventory....missing titles that have not been caught and need replacement. Instructor>>I think it's interesting however that in our library surveys, the students seem to have a perception that our collections are "old" even though we buy lots of new materials.... Les Canterbury>>Kelly - how do you deal with the howling - or keep it from happening? Michelle Blackman>>Inventory! You have an actual inventory! Les Canterbury>>we have the same problem Scott - new titles seem to get absorbed and become invisible Michelle Blackman>>Most of our books were published before our current students were born. Thus, the label OLD. Kelly Janousek>>Howling was dealt with by the Dean but it has been a problem by only those few who I think just like to howl. Instructor>>I wonder if the portable barcode readers that are often used for inventory could be helpful in weeding projects -- has anyone done anything with that? Leslie Swigart>>Perception of "old" collections is true -- the % of brand new to "older" materials is *very* small in most libraries; and if you remove the dust jackets the bindings can get to looking old very quickly on high circ books due to wear-n-tear. Kelly Janousek>>Long Beach is trying the barcode readers in a childrens collection. Kelly Janousek>>We don't have enough yet to put it "real" collection use. Kelly Janousek>>How many use circulation records? Kelly Janousek>>How many look to see how many other local libraries own the book? Les Canterbury>>We are leaving colorful jackets on some new books to make the shelves look brighter - bright=new Instructor>>In my current 16mm film project circ. records are certainly an important factor...so many of these films are just not getting used anymore... Cynthia Bruns>>We have done some spot weeding based on Circulation records Leslie Swigart>>RE: 16 mm; are you going to try to replace hi circ titles on VHS or DVD if available? Or just w/d Les Canterbury>>Kelly: I do both - check circ records sometimes - check to see who else has it Kelly Janousek>>Les does this make a difference in keeping or letting go? Instructor>>Yes -- we have already replaced some titles with other video formats -- and if faculty say "keep that title" we'll seek to buy a video/DVD first -- then keep the film if video is not available.. Les Canterbury>>Kelly - definitely - esp. the circ record Instructor>>I will be talking about media de-selection at the CARL pre-conf, but if any of you are interested in the 16mm project specifically, info is at this web page: http://www.calstatela.edu/library/mmc/films.html Kelly Janousek>>I have found our copy doesn't circ but everyone owns one...ours is gone with ILL and cooperatives like Link+ we can get the materials fairly fast here. Andrew Shroyer>>I think the potential for faculty worry and assurance that faculty will have input is the most sensitive issue. In my opinion, best approach is to publicize your effort widely on campus, and allow generous windows of time for feedback (don't give them opportunity to say they weren't informed) Leslie Swigart>>Re: Time -- How generous? Andrew Shroyer>>at least 6 weeks--my opinion only... Instructor>>As an example -- with the film weeding project, our Library Subcommittee asked us to give one full quarter of time before the final cuts are made... Leslie Swigart>>Re: Fac input on weeding -- just unique to campus items? or duplicates? or weeding of bound periodicals if converting to MF or e-format? Instructor>>TIME HEADS-UP ---- We have about 5 more minutes left to chat! Leslie Swigart>>INSTRUCTOR: Who constitutes your Library Subcmte? Inst. Fac? Kelly Janousek>>would sharing of de-selection policies and guidelines help at the CARL pre-conference? Andrew Shroyer>>Leslie, I think the judgment where faculty input is needed and where librarian input will suffice will vary all over the place--and with different types of material. I know we quietly laid to rest many duplicates and tattered volumes here... Instructor>>Andrew -- who all is on the Library Subcommittee? I think it's mostly faculty, the UL, and a rep from the library faculty... Instructor>>I think sharing of any written guidelines for those of us presenting would give us some good food for thought/discussion... Andrew Shroyer>>Our Library Subc. is a derivative of the Educational Policy Cte. It is mostly teaching faculty, but I believe there are 2 librarians in addition to the UL (as Exec. Secretary) on it right now... Diana Wu>>I have some to share. email me. Instructor>>Thanks DW... Instructor>>Question for all of you -- would you like me to send all of you a transcript of this chat? Cynthia Bruns>>I would like one Andrew Shroyer>>Anyone else care to email related documents--or even just thoughts--to the panelists? Diana Wu>>please. thanks for hosting this chat. Les Canterbury>>transcript - yes, please Instructor>>Andrew -- any parting thoughts before we sign off? Michelle Blackman>>re: transcript, no, thanks. Andrew Shroyer>>My thoughts have already parted... Instructor>>Thanks
to everyone who participated today! |